Pro-Palestinian activists march through London (HENRY NICHOLLS/AFP via Getty Images)
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Way back in 2005, when I was an MP in the Netherlands, my party was strategising about the upcoming local elections. I belonged to the centre-right VVD, and we were particularly concerned about appealing to the nation’s growing migrant community. After much discussion, the leaders settled on Laetitia Griffith to represent us in Amsterdam. She was black and had roots in Suriname, a former Dutch colony in the Caribbean. She could pull in the city’s Creole vote. More importantly, the VVD’s strategists thought she could win over some of the city’s Muslim population.
In the hope of making this task easier, the strategy group also issued a peculiar demand: that I keep silent on all issues to do with Islam, at least until after the election. They then went even further and asked that I publicly state that Islam is a religion of peace.
Suffice it to say that I refused. I explained why refusing to question the threat of Islamism wasn’t exactly a shrewd political tactic. Instead, I emphasised, we should be encouraging Muslim minorities to integrate and embrace Dutch values. But the party sided with Griffith, I was put on the naughty step, and we lost the election. Yet even this didn’t give the leadership pause for thought, its main takeaway being: if we wanted to win in the country’s four largest cities, we should continue to give isolationist forms of Islam a free pass. As I was told over and over by my senior colleagues, it was numerical common sense.
Over the past 18 years, we have witnessed the repercussions of such “common sense” — and not just in the Netherlands. Across the West, the fracturing force of Islamism is causing once-mighty political traditions to creak. In France, for instance, Emmanuel Macron is now doing his best to talk tough on Islam in an attempt to claw back what political authority he hasn’t spent. In the US, meanwhile, the Democrats have no such luxury: concerns are already starting to creep in that they could lose this year’s election if the pro-Palestine supporters mobilised by well-organised Islamists stay home in swing states. Already in Michigan, Rashida Talib has urged Democrats not to vote for Biden.
Even the United Kingdom, that island nation often seen as immune to radical forces, is now being forced to reckon with Islamism. In the week since the Labour Party suspended its candidate in Rochdale, much blame has been placed on a nebulous strain of antisemitism. What’s been missing, however, is an appreciation for where this prejudice so often originates: it is not just the product of an activist-decoloniser undergraduate politics, but of the party’s willingness to appease its Islamist voters.
This phenomenon, of course, extends well beyond the confines of Rochdale and one particular party. Rather, we are witnessing what Christopher Caldwell identified as “the revolution in Europe”. As far back as 2009, Caldwell observed how the mass immigration of Muslims was altering the culture of Europe. These new arrivals were, he noted, not enhancing the spirit of Europe’s cities but supplanting it. As he wrote: “When an insecure, malleable, relativistic culture meets a culture that is anchored, confident, and strengthened by common doctrines, it is generally the former that changes to suit the latter.”
For this, he (like many others) was dismissed by many as a fear-mongering xenophobe. And, taking note of his treatment, Europe’s political leaders continued to sell us false promises about multiculturalism — without realising that, in doing so, they were allowing this process of Islamisation to take root.
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SubscribePeople calling for a ceasefire in Gaza are not the fanatics, any more than we were when we opposed the wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya, and any more than we are when we oppose killing people in Yemen because they happened to live in the same place as those who were imposing a blockade that had itself killed or injured no one at all.
There was a ceasefire in Gaza, until October 7th when something broke it. I forget what.
‘Some people did something.’
Not true. The Israelis were imposing a blockade on Gaza and would not allow Gaza to use it’s airport. Also it would not allow Gaza to develop off shore gas and oil reserves. But more to the point, over 200 Palestinians were killed by illegal settlers and IDF in the west bank BEFORE Oct 7. Hardly a ceasefire.
Now enlighten us on what the poor, innocents of Hamas were doing in Gaza prior to October 7th that occasioned such a blockade.
Now enlighten us on what the poor, innocents of the IDF were doing in Gaza prior to October 7th that occasioned such an action.
Guess it was not very effective (the blockade). The Palestinians are not interested in creating a business economy in Gaza. If fact it would appear they destroyed all businesses after the Jewish people left Gaza. They lived off the UN, and planned and plotted their genocide of the Jews.
There were no IDF soldiers in Gaza prior to the 7th.
People calling for a ceasefire in Gaza rarely call for the release of all hostages first. They rarely acknowledge the devastation caused in Gaza by Hamas and they never, ever mention the millions of people killed in other Arab countries by their own governments.
How many countries are currently accepting refugees from Gaza?
None.
Actually many of those calling for a ceasefire are also calling for the hostages to be released, but how many of those calling for the hostages to be released, and are calling for Palestinian hostages held by Israel, including over 3000 held under “administrative detention” and hundreds of children, to be released?
If you genuinely cared about the hostages, you would be calling for a ceasefire, because that is so far the best way to get the hostages back. Yes they got 2 back by force, but killed 3 hostages in the process.
Why should countries that are mainly dessert have to host refugees? It would make far more sense for Israelis to move to the western countries that say they support Israel.
If what you are saying in the first sentence is true, I certainly have not heard it. Not even heard a faint whisper about hostages.
So we have created a new victimhood, all the Palestinians held by Israel are now ‘hostages’; great gaslighting FF.
STOP THE PRESS. It is all Israel’s fault; (sarcasm)
Perhaps not – but you are the people effectively calling for the continuation of hostage taking and random acts of savagery perpetrated against women and children.
You seem to be forgetting that the Israelis have been committing “random acts of savagery perpetrated against women and children” against the actual indigenes for a century.
And they’re not getting any less savage:
https://www.antiwar.com/blog/2024/02/15/idf-let-israeli-civilians-film-torture-of-palestinian-detainees-report/
This is part of the end of the world and the imminent return of Christ. We have 2 possible fixed dates for calculating his return and they both yield the same date for the church rapture. The first date is the 2000 anniversary of the assentation into Heaven Pentecost in 2033 subtract 7 years for the tribulation gives 2066. Israel’s Independence Day in 1948 is the second date. A standard life in the Bible is 90 years. A 12-year-old Bar Mitza Jew in 1948 is scheduled to die in 2066. Christ said that that generation will not pass away until all these things come to pass. These two dates independently seem to give a church Rapture date of Sunday May 30, 2066. Christ said that “not even the son knows the date but only the Father knows.” D day may be classified but one can observe the troops moving toward the invasion beaches and Israel’s Independence Day is a big indicator.
We don’t have this Rapture thing in European Christianity, I think an American salesman invented it. Probably trying to sell something….
Yes, woolen underwear, because it can be quite chilly up there. Protect your bones from the heavenly humidity.
The origin is actually and surprisingly an 18th century Jesuit from Chile (whose name Ihave forgotten). It really took off in the preaching of Charles Nelson Darby (founder of the Plymouth Brethren). So not really originating in the US at all.
So that’ll make it the centennial anniversary of England’s 1966 World Cup victory.
“Some people are on the pitch, they think it’s all over..it is now!
Very droll
20 weeks ago, I would have read this article with interest. I don’t particularly like the rise of Islam in Britain. But everything has changed, changed utterly.
Muslims are the leading opponents of British support for genocide.
The problem is Jewish influence, not Islam.
Only looking after their fellow islamists . They fully supported the attacks on the dance festival etc .Or was that like the Easter rising ?
But the 21% Arab population in Israel isn’t having Free Palestine hate marches in Tel Aviv, Haifa or even Jaffa. Arabs are not required to do mandatory military service in the IDF, though many do. Since 7th October there has been a big rise in Arab recruitment to combat units, wishing to protect the only democracy in the Middle East.
Look at the example Islam sets when it’s in control – Iran, Arabia, Islamic State, Al Qaeda, Taliban. Compare those with the democratic jurisdiction of Israel. Sure Israeli politics is flawed but no more so than other democracies are or would be in their situation.
As Youtube’s Apostate Prophet says… “Stay away from islam”.
2033 minus 7 is 2026 not 2066. Phew , not so long to wait
You forgot the changeover from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar in 1752. When it happened, people protested that they’d “lost” 11 days off their lives.
You’re wasting your own life with this drivel, but that’s your choice.
Fortunately we are in the year 2777 AUC*.
(*Ab urbe condita.)
To put it mildly, your reasoning is eccentric. When family members suggest you follow more grounded pursuits, you should listen to them.
If you are going to make predictions like this it would be a good idea to check your maths – is 2026 the date you’re shooting for?
Oh no. Very big risk Jesus & Angels will VAR the third goal and rule that it did not cross the line….
Sadly, not entirely a moral and political vacuum. We have our glorious Western post-Christian values of tolerance and inclusiveness – for which wisdom we never fail to congratulate ourselves (even unto our own destruction).
Are you including the church of Justin Welby in the ‘glorious Western post-Christian values of tolerance and inclusiveness ‘ or do you expect lining up behind Justin and his lady vicars will lead to a crusade or reconquista ?
Actually it’s becoming obvious secular woke post Christian values are the values of Justin Welby and the Church of England . I don’t understand what help Ayaan Hirsi Ali believes is going to come from that quarter .
Your concern is justified but, unless you faithfully, responsibly and consistently show up for worship in some church every Sunday and do your part, your words are empty.
[Correction] “Your concern is justified but, provided you faithfully, responsibly and consistently show up for worship in some church every Sunday and do your part; unless your words are empty.”
Did you know you can edit?
Not in the least. Sometimes the onlooker sees more of the match.
And gets to run away before the action starts.
Rubbish.
This is a non-reply. Stu Std makes a good point it seems a good few agree with, as I do.
It’s a safety in numbers game. This is how Salman Rushdie’s book was able to be burnt so openly, fiercely and triumphantly in public. AHA is now on Team Christianity, I reckon, because in the past anyway, it was a force that stood up to the Muslim wave. The Christian base contains some that are unhinged, but the overall numbers provides some measure of safety against encroaching Islamisation.
I don’t want integration … of Quranic / Mohamedic values into the British fabric. I don’t want any of it.
But you do, for certain! I guarantee the vast majority of the Qu’ran’s teachings are EXACTLY what you want built into the British fabric …assuming you’re a decent human being with good Christian values because they are the SAME!
Yep. “Death to infidels” is right up there. What’s your guarantee worth?
Let’s hear them then.
Even greater rubbish.
Which is what Isis ,whose leaders were all serious Islamic scholars, so clearly demonstrated .
Or if you prefer Saudi Arabia , Iran , Pakistan and Afghanistan . All models of ‘good Christian values ‘ because they are the SAME .
Hey Liam did you go to one of those boarding schools run by the Christian Brothers ? I was told by one of the old boys their beliefs had much in common with ISIS .
Oh YOU were being IRONIC ! Liam that’s not all that easy to spot , because Justin and his bishops and vicars probably believe pretty much what you posted and certainly the multi -cultists at the BBC and the universities . And the main political parties . Good wind up anyway ! Edit
The archbish of Canterbury was dragged up in the gutter. It’s true. So he knows what life is like for us poor bastards.
He is a silly man and proves it each time he opens his mouth.
Ridiculous!
Rolls on floor laughing! Are you making that simplistic atheist assumption that all people are good at heart,all people have an innate moral compass,no one would kill,seduce,traduce,betray or swindle anyone else in a perfect,fair and just society. Because many people are AMORAL and they do not have a Moral Compass . I am one of them,that’s how I know. If I spoke to you in the pub where most atheists seem to hang out most of the time – if they can find one open I guess that isn’t now a Tesco Express,or if I sat by you at your “this is just like the good bits of church” Sunday get together,you would go,”Ugh,get away from me,I’m not talking to you, as an atheist I live by high moral standards of behaviour and impeccable conduct. I can see that you are a depraved deplorable so I am going to freeze you out”. A great deal of history including HISTORY involves populations reaching a critical mass by which point they cease to be the “pat on the head” minority. Labour has got White Saviour Complex. They don’t like brown skinned people who get uppity and don’t want or need their patronising attention. Their voter base goes AWOL and votes Tory once its got a foothold.
What you claim to be an “atheist assumption” is nothing of the kind.
There’s only one group making false assumptions here, and it’s not atheists.
Exactly.
You’re slurring your words; that’s enough booze for now.
Exactly
Jane Baker, I was with you until you declared that you have no moral compass, which is to say, a sociopath. Frightening.
You could probably say the same for Mein Kampf (My Jihad). When I skim-read it, it sounded like a modern social justice tract, even down to blaming Jews for being over-privileged.
No thanks. Any belief system that incorporates misogyny, hatred of Jews and LGBT and threatens death to anyone who challenges or makes fun of their belief system is anathema to me.
That’s true of all religions. Every last one is misogynist, based on promoting the self interest of men and the subjugation of women in the service of men. In the meantime, we have to look at the greatest threat which at present is Islam and join whatever is available to counter it. Druids are not so well organised as the Christians nor as powerful, after all they are in the House of Lords. Yes it’s the Christians I will go into battle with. We can sirt them out afterwards.
“Oh ye who believe! Take not the Jew and the Christian for friends. They are friend to one another. He among you who take them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not the wrongdoing folk.”
(Qu’ran, chapter 5, verse 51)
The book is riddled with chapters of similar sentiment and devout Muslims endeavour to learn the lot, by heart. OBL could recite every chapter, and ISIS leader (and Caliphate butcher) Abu Bakr al Baghdadi was a Qu’ranic scholar. The book is being given away, free, on the streets of London — or was, the last time I visited, in 2023.
Clearly you have never read that book, and if you did peruse a few pages, you failed to understand the contents! The Bible and the Quran are not the same.
1. Most parts of the Bible are descriptive rather than prescriptive. All of the Quran is prescriptive, which means no changes can be made and there is very little room for interpretation.
2. Abrogation: older, more peaceful parts are abrogated by chronologically newer, and always more violent parts. If you don’t know why that is, look up the fictitious biography of the so-called prophet, and his path from illiterate merchant to bloodthirsty and power-hungry warlord.
3. A violent child molester whose urges and wishes were conveniently “approved” by divine revelations, which arrived just when needed, is considered the most perfect human being! No, thanks!
There is much more, of course, and I hope for you that you won’t find your way at the receiving end of Islamic justice. On the other hand, it might be a curative experience.
Humm, somewhere here fits the saying, ‘best to befriend your enemy’s enemy’. I, as an atheist, will join any Christian crusade if it’s fighting off Islam. Bring it on.
Christianity is less concerned with “defeating” Islam and more concerned with saving souls. From the Christian perspective, the atheist is in a more desperate situation than a pious Muslim who in his heart seeks God.
Muslims aren’t the ones who slaughter millions of children in abortuaries, flood the world with porn and deify homosexuality and transgenderism.
Tell that to my maternal ancestors who bravely fought against the Ottomans at the gates of Vienna in 1683! As for your second claim in sentence three, the people who do this are in it for money and power. Our relative wealth and stability have corrupted us. In the meantime, here is a little tidbit for giggles: https://www.moroccoworldnews.com/2019/05/274074/moroccans-porn-consumption-ramadan
Israel is trying to do just that against Hamas and its mindless fellow-travellers
I didn’t read anything in this article that suggested that that the course Justin Welby had led the C of E down will address the problem of militant and exploitative Islam. Rather that it was adherence to those values by themselves without a robust underlying counternarrative that was allowing militant, malign Islam to gain traction in the West.
I know she didn’t say that . It is often now said we are still a Christian society in that contemporary secular values actually derive from Christianity . My concern is that that is possibly true and it’s not obvious whether Welby and the CofE ( the actual state official religion ) is parroting woke values or woke values are unconsciously derived from where Christianity has been drifting post Darwin . Either way the established church is not going to provide any kind of defence against islamisation with its current leadership . It’s too masochistic , too obsessed with giving hospitality to outsiders ,the more hostile and sinful the better. Actually woke vicars aren’t especially putting themselves at risk . They like to think they are , but , when a vicar consciously helps an Islamist get a passport by pretending to convert him to Christianity , it won’t be him who is put in much danger . It’ll be others .
It was in a previous article that AHA said she was becoming a Christian , and others seemed to think this was because she sees it a necessary check against islamisation . If only it were .
Good points Alan. Even though we might not practice Christanity, we Brits are all imbuded with a mix of Christian vaules tempered with J Bentham. We are not easliy going to roll over and submit the Islam.
Right you are, Ms Chambers!
There are not many people who have a better understanding of Islam and Islamization than Ayaan. I was surprised when she became a Christian but I am sure she will not be one of those Christians who enables and elevates Muslims by pretending that Islamic values are the same as Christian values.
The CoE has to be taken back from the jackasses who run it. The jackasses who run it are not Christians: they are social justice warriors, ie they are peddling new-Marxist crap.
It is an incredible predicament for practicing Christians. Luckily, christian worship is not particularly interactive, so one can go through life without having to deal with this type of non christian activism – transgenderism (say). There is no taking it back, it just has to be ignored and this is what I see most people doing.
I am referring to the churches, the precincts which are the beautiful heirloom we inherited. They have been kidnapped by jackasses. The properties must be reclaimed. How? By whom?
Indeed, society must be tolerant and inclusive to the point that some of us are excluded. Scientific reality and the rights of some people (particularly women and children) must all g8ve way to the woke agenda.
Im surprised, but very pleased, the average UnHerd read supports this assertion. I can only assume thd majority missed the irony?
It’s been clear for some time you inject Al Jazeera directly into your veins, Liam, so I wouldn’t be too pleased if ‘the average’ reader can’t spot the garbled attempt at irony here from your regular hallucinations
Dear Dr E C,
We all recognise Liam for what he is. I am beginning to believe that he belongs to those who have to experience in order to be convinced. Perhaps being on the receiving end of some Islamic “justice” will cure him of his delusions?
Unless Islamism is dealt with it will drive people towards the far right. Make your choice political classes.
To oppose question the teachings of Islam is not “extreme right”
Those who suggest so do no favours to that need
It all depends on your definition of ‘right’ in politics. More certain is that Islam is an authoritarian religion and, even in some less-extreme versions, approves of the goal of an Islamic theocracy dominating the globe, by force if necessary. It’s only real claims to being a ‘religion of peace’ are that it upholds an ideal of all Muslims living in peace together and another that anyone else should do as they are told by Muslims.
I’m not suggesting all Muslims are fanatics! but that the basic tenets of Islam are autocratic and elitist, which allows a viciously aggressive culture to thrive without criticism.
Yes, a religion of peace to those who accept; death to those who don’t
“Accept”? “Submit” would be a better word.
Is not Islamism essentially an extreme-right political-religious movement? They believe in enforcing a puritanical dress code on women. They strongly disapprove of homosexuality. They are pretty patriarchal in their approach. Does this sound like a liberal left progressive organisation? Even their approval of polyamory- the latest progressive enthusiasm- is confined to polygamy and has more than a hint of patriarchy. It sounds like the sort of thing your average far-right bloke would be slavering to support. Would not the extreme-right want to support this antidote to all the wet feminist atheistic rot ruining the West? They are even on the same page as the bloke with the toothbrush mustachio, the poster-boy of the extreme right, as far as Jews are concerned.
Could you explain that in the context of the last Remembrance Sunday please.
The media barely DO Remembrance Sunday now since the conflict erupted in Ukraine. We used to have weeks of documentaries about the horror and pity of War. Readings of Wilfred Owens poems. Battlefield walks. The interview with Harry Patch. But now we have to be GungHo about War again. We have to be full of bloodthirsty desire to tear Russians limb from limb,we have to approve of “giving” millions of pounds/dollars worth of armaments so whoever can squit on whoever else. As it’s an Arms “trade” that means someone is paying ,but who,apart from the tax payer who intends his/her contribution for the infrastructure of their society.
The ‘extreme right’ really only exists in the fantasy of leftists, you know. It’s not actually a thing in any significant way. Even Tommy Robinson is pretty mainstream liberal in all respects other than his opposition to Islamisation. The ‘extreme right’ is essentially just your version of Emmanuel Goldstein.
says yet another, delusional extreme right winger, perhaps. Nobody is going to admit to being an extreme rightwinger are they? Part of being an extremist is believing yourself to be moderate and your moderate opponents to be extremists; it’s in thd DNA isn’t it?
Please identify these extreme right wing organizations.
You can find them in any bad Hollywood movie. There’s always a bad white guy with a swastika tattoo.
typical non-answer
My comment was directed towards the assumption by James Love that unless Islamism is dealt with it would drive people to the far right. Islamists have many beliefs that would normally characterise them as “right wing”. The left particularly the extreme left has throughout history been characterised by anti-religious and atheist sentiments. Religion was attacked during the French Revolution and seldom is promoted under communism except in some nationalist form.
You are, of course, correct that right and left have been drained of much meaning and “extreme right” has simply become a catchphrase to encompass whatever ideological difference the speaker wants to emphasise and disparage.
I could easily imagine a populist “extreme left party” seeking to gain or retain power by attacking the pernicious effects of Islam, the “opium of the people”. The strong family and clan ties fostered by Islam is a direct threat to the centralising anti-family sentiments of the authoritarian left. The present alignment of the left with Islamism may be no more permanent than the Soviet pact with the ruling NSDAP party – a mere temporary convenience – there is really no natural ideological alignment between Islamist and leftist ideology.
..as indeed are Zionists themselves! But extremists tend to hate other extremists for minor differences even when the majority of their extremist views are in line. Perhaps this us a good thing? Look at what happened when extremist Evangelicals lined up with murderous Zionists.. genocide!
Not putting up with this jew-hater any longer. Sayonara.
I have reaad your comment with interest. I simply cannot see why, in the US, evengelical Christians are almost invariably Republican.
The right wing attitude that when people do not do well, it is because they have not made enough effort, is the opposite of Jesus’ teaching about the poor. (In the UK this almost defined Margaret Thatcher although as a particulaarly intelligent person from a modest background who did not realise her own intelligence, it could almost be interpreted as humility!)
I agree that Islamism has the rigidity of the right wing.
I thought the extreme right wing opinion as to why people have not done well is supposed to be more that they have not done well because they are inherently inferior.
Undoubtedly some people don’t do well because they have not made enough effort but that might be because they are exercising their freedom of choice to spend their time doing something that will not result in their doing well in a conventional sense. Is that bad? If the person complains about the result and attributes it to wicked capitalism they take on a left wing analysis. I am always uncertain about Jesus’s teaching regarding the poor – the parable of the talents suggest a rather harsh view of those who fail to make use of the talents they are given. I am not sure he would enthusiastically embrace a policy whereby large sections of the population are supported in idleness as a broad principle. Would that make him a right winger?
Of course, we humans are great at making patterns of random shapes and self contradictory words and can interpret the Bible to fit our own prejudices.
‘rigidity’ applies to the majority of political wings. The only difference I find between left and right. Is that one only gets obfuscation and non-answers from the left. The certainty of belief seems to be common to all polarities/
Except it in reality it is the far left ‘progressive’ liberals that march lockstep with the islamists. They share similar totalitarian mindsets. The red-green alliance has been marching on the streets of western countries for 3 solid months now.
You know what you say is complete rubbish. Why do you feel the need to compartmentalize everything into left or right. It then becomes one total smear job. Is facism left or right?
They keep calling sensible, conservative people n*z*s but don’t realise they are recreating the Weimar republic.
..asdid the people who supported the Weimar Republic! Look how that turned out!
Try this: Unless moderate Muslims are nurtured they will drift towards extremism especially if attacked by racial bigots.
One of the few sensible things you have said. Most Muslims are moderate and want the same things we all want – freedom and prosperity.
Not if you were brought up in a household in which money and wealth was despised and spoken of with contempt. (I’ve got over it!)
This is the odd thing though,and it affects us all,native British or of ethnic background. At some point an individual gets to a level of affluence,not even wealth and he/she/they become a target for the sort of contempt I’ve described above,the despisers may believe their dismissal is from religious principles ie do not hoard up treasure on earth,blessed are the poor (How?),but often it’s envy and jealousy paraded as moral virtue.
Plus 80% want Israel destroyed.
Unless you were indoctrinated as a child. The Palestinians do not want freedom and prosperity, they want the Land of Israel.
Your view of Muslims is so incredibly infantilising: you’re suggesting that unless society ‘nurtures’ them like babies they’ll ‘drift’ towards murder, gang rape, acid attacks, FGM etc. Can you hear yourself?
They’ve made their choice. You can use dog-whistle legislation to imprison the right (e.g. “misinformation”, aka non-leftist opinions), but easily offended Islamists have to be treated with kid gloves lest they turn violent. Apparently not much can be done about violent Islamists because that’d be racist, or at least “Islamophobic”.
We British are good at turning a blind eye to inconvenient facts. For example, Lutfur Rahman got away with it for years in Tower Hamlets, until a small group of concerned citizens, at great cost to themselves, revealed what was going on. The police were forced to take action.
There are murky goings-on in Rochdale and elsewhere. I hope the London-based media shows some sustained interest for a change, so we get to the bottom of it.
You’ve more chance of winning the lottery the same day you marry Miss World and score the winning goal in the FA Cup Final than our partisan media swimming against the DEI tide. Even the Telegraph is being bought by islamists.
..much of the problem is the failure to tell moderate, decent Muslims (with values every bit a good as, often far better than, so-called Christians and their racist, bigoted, genocidal views) from the tiny minority of Islamist extremists within that artifical grouping.. Imagine how stupid it would be to label all Christians as extremist Evangelical Zionists! Yet that in effect, is what you’re doing!
Where are all the “moderate, decent Muslims” when their extremist brothers attack Israel? Oh yeah, in the support Hamas parade.
In Indonesia, by far the largest Muslim nation
What percentage of the Muslims in Britain are from Indonesia?
Genuine question.
Oh really?
https://www.france24.com/en/tv-shows/focus/20240214-indonesia-s-religious-minorities-fear-radical-islam
You have a very valid point, Liam. Tarring all Muslims with the same brush leaves the moderates isolated and demoralised. And the average Muslim who’s tempted by extremist rhetoric will think, “Might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb.”
We are doing ourselves no favours.
Have you ever heard any muslim moderate speak out against any ‘allah akbar’ terrorist attack.
Good question. The general response seems to be to say “They ( the terrorists) cannot be Muslims”! I heard this response immediately following 9/11, for example.
Lutfur Rahman is now back in power in his fiefdom of Tower Hamlets, this time heading up his own political party.
The people in charge don’t have a clue. Clever idiots, they were promoted far beyond their ability perform.
Politicians need to put on their big boy pants and treat Muslims like anyone else – no special privileges, no soft bigotry of low expectations. Muslims are a small minority of the population. They may be well organized, but their political influence is amplified by weaklings. In 2017, only 1.1% of the population in the USA identified as Muslim. In Britain, Muslims were 4.4% of the population in 2023. This is not a huge voting block. There may be isolated constituencies where Muslims make a large voting block, but these are the outliers.
Politicians need to put on their big boy pants in general and work out what they believe. Then, they have to convince us that their ideas are good ones. If we don’t think they’re good ideas, we can vote for someone else.
They need to stop trying to guess what we want, like at a job interview.
I’m sure in the olden days it wasn’t like this.
Whilst most politicians are only interested in keeping their sorry arses sat firmly in the first class seats aboard the gravy train, I don’t hold out much hope for them firmly and honestly nailing any colours to masts any time soon.
But Jim, our State Equality Laws compel special and elevated privilege for Muslims! They sit atop the new CRT shaped Hierarchy of Victimhood and Privilege! Yes our progressive political classes are moral cowards who have acted appallingly. They all bow the knee to identitarianism and the nasty street Mobs. But this most twisted of State laws makes your rightful aspiration of tougher fair dealing with a now existential problem for us and Europe doubly impossible.
The APPG British Muslims definition of ‘Islamopobia’ implies being Muslim is an inherent trait. It therefore automatically undermines the position and safety of apostates and leaving those of Jihadi ilk rub their hands with glee. It is an astonishing own-goal.
The definition has been adopted by all parties apart from the Tories, I believe.
Equality laws were never meant to offer special privileges. They were meant to ensure that nobody got treated less favourably under the law due to their, race, gender etc etc. The big mistake was including religion in the list of protected characteristics. Devout religionists always want to impose their views on everyone else – and none are as good as the Muslims at conning the simple-minded in order to get what they want. Political beliefs aren’t protected under equality law so why should religion?
“Political beliefs aren’t protected under equality law so why should religion?”
Spot on. Religions are nothing more than belief systems. IMO the inverse is also true.
I agree Eleanor. The architects of EQA were naive liberal progressives akin to Chinese scientists at Wuhan trying to make the world ‘safer’ by tinkering with research outlawed in the West. But the law like the virus was unsafe and once out in society it has mutated and evolved unpredictably and wildly, to toxic effect. It was pulsed out into every corner of society because it was a mandated State law, not the whim of looney academics. The State did not stop to think – if we posit victims (The Nine), that requires oppressors (White male Patriarchy). So – stunningly – they embedded Americas toxic Critical Race Theory at the heart of a new multicultural mass immigration society. The Nine are now privileged not just in law but in popular culture media art theatre and in coverage by a captured BBC. And the cynical cretins in the Labour Party seek only to deepen the rift by making more EQA about the only policy they are prepared to share.
They will not assimilate. They have large families and school indoctrination.
There are over 2,000,000,000 Muslims in the world and with their fertility rate as high as it is, that number increases nearly exponentially. Yes, they are 1.1% of the US population, but they don’t assimilate. Notable is that nearly 30% of Muslims in the US are Islamophobes themselves.
Anyone who has not read Michel Houellebecq’s novel Submission should really do so right away. 8 years ago, it’s setting of the French Left making common cause with the Islamists to defeat the National Rally Party seemed far-fetched. Not so much anymore.
In any EU country, the Left’s acceptance of militant Islam appears to be proportional to the number of Muslim voters and the polling percentage of the (increasingly misnamed) far-Right party in said country.
A more important introduction to what could happen in France, and is well on the way to what is already happening, is a collection of selected political writing by Renaud Camus (“the other Camus”), titled Enemy of the Disaster. The “Disaster” is known as “the Great Replacement”–a reference to the replacement of French culture by Islamicization. A large percentage of Muslims living in France today have migrated north not to enjoy the benefits of a French way of life but to replace it with their own. America has a crisis at its southern border, but at least the migrants swarming up from Mexico want to be assimilated.
WHY have the French “lost their bottle”!
I seem to recall that they knew precisely what to do in Paris in October 1961.
Gilet Jeaune?
There’s much room for ‘improvement’.
130 different countries and counting; well over 50% being single males in their twenties and thirties.
What exactly, would a reading of Submission achieve? The book has been referred to many, many times in the UnHerd forums. I’m sure all the readers here know about it even if they have not actually read it (a bit like Orwell’s 1984 in that respect).
Do you imagine the UnHerd readership will spring into action and create a movement dedicated to turning back the migrant hordes? Face the truth – this is an opinion churning talk shop and conservatives are probably the most politically lazy people you could find. They love to talk in strong terms about how the world is going wrong and that somebody somewhere ought to do something about it – then they are surprised to find that determined activist ideologues under the banner of Social Justice have marched through their prized institutions.
‘The exception proves the rule’ as The Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei so amply demonstrated not that long ago.
Wasn’t their cry “tomorrow belongs to me”?
You’ve lost me. How is the German Workers Party an exception that proves the rule? A revolutionary rather than conservative movement surely.
Do you imagine that conservative British workers might rise up from their comfy sofas and march into the streets in such vast numbers that our shifty governing class would be forced to find a way to turn back the migrant hordes they currently feel obliged to welcome? Dream on Stanhope.
Newton’s Third Law.
You speak in riddles. Why?
Equal and opposite forces. Every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Rather like Hegel’s thesis and antithesis though Hegel allows for synthesis.
No, conservative British workers will not march as they are too afraid of being outed as ‘far-right’ and uncaring by the mainstream media. How then would that affect their job prospects and those in social circles who would be quite happy to ‘not invite them’ in various ways.
There are outliers who do it, Ann Marie Waters for one. Her reward?She appeared compared and equated with an extremist Islamist on a BBC programme some years back. Wikipedia, or whoever has the most determination in editing her page, characterisers her as ‘Far Right’.
Nobody said it would be easy. As I noted in my initial comment posted in the early hours of this morning we are too proud of our virtues of tolerance and inclusiveness – hence the fear of being labelled far right or uncaring. You might be interested in this:
https://www.amren.com/features/2012/07/pathological-altruism/
The link is to a detailed review of a book which explores the way in which altruism can become self-destructive.
A mere NINE words will sort this out:
Front rank FIRE!
Middle rank FIRE!
Rear rank FIRE!
You’re a bad egg Charlie and no mistake!!
An openly anti semitie calling someone e else a bad egg.
I have written it before, but I am quite fond of you, Mr Stanhope. I don’t agree with you on everything, but I respect your clarity of thought and your knowledge of history. Rare characteristics these days.
The dockers marched, and were ignored, their leaders pilloried and sacked. The race riots of the 1050s, largely against the beloved Windrush generation, led to the marchers being imprisoned for very long periods of time.
One fly in your ointment is your failure to observe the vast number of British Workers who are themselves immigrants or 2nd generation immigrants..
Another fly is your failure to see the vary divergence of views among (a) workers and (b) Immigrants ..and indeed (c) British even those who are white (nominally) Christians. Not all members of superficially gathered groupings think alike.
“conservatives are probably the most politically lazy people”. It is not so much we are lazy but that telling other people what to do is, almost by definition, anti-Conservative and so hard to justify being an activist.
No, but you can stand up at meetings and say, “There’s another way to look at this.”
The Party says there is no other way. And the Party is infallible.
Or as Solzhenitsyn says, you can refuse to participate in meetings where obvious falsehoods are being affirmed as the truth.
Getting off the couch:
– Get informed by conservative thought leaders like Jordan Peterson and AHA. (They haven’t been silenced yet.)
– Show up at local party events and speak out. More people will agree with you than you realize
– If your reasonable logic will get you expelled, then get expelled but free some hostages in the process
– It’s not too late.
1) It’s a very good book. Entertaining but with a message. In that vein, I consider Handmaid’s Tale worth reading on the same basis, even though I disagree with its message.
2) A great many conservatives still do not seem to take the immigration problem seriously.
You’re right, conservatives are generally preoccupied with things outside of politics; I wouldn’t say “lazy”, but I understand what you mean. All the more reason for them to wake up. Western governments are not going to defend civilization. Those who believe in it must act accordingly (ala The Benedict Option) to do so themselves.
That’s why you read Submission.
..much too narrow a view. Like any great lie it has a marvelling of truth to give it traction..
… a marbling of truth to make it tastier?
If only western politicians had the wit to consider 1400 years of violent, antisemitic jihad before destroying our culture with mass islamic immigration.
The secularised Jewish liberals were/are right behind this . They seemed to believe secularisation of Muslims was as inevitable as secularisation of everyone else . Any other thought was ‘racist’ .
Did they, the Jews, do it to themselves?
I realise that’s sarcasm . I am not saying Jews are solely responsible for mass migration of Muslims post ww2 . Just saying it’s equally silly to cast Jews as ALL perpetual victims with no agency . In my own family I have one progressive narcissist for a cousin and her son is a woeful hypocrite of a Newsnight ‘producer’ who will protect serious criminals in his own family ( including a senior policeman) if he calculates it’s in his own interests.
Ah, once again, it’s all the fault of the Jews.
Unfortunately leftist Jews spearheaded modern mass migration into Europe and the US. Many of them make no secret of it. Check out Barbara Spector et Al. Probably to counteract white supremism but it has backfired. Jews have not been such targets in a long time and its not from white supremacists. Mass Islamic migration serves no purpose except to destroy the west like a boiling frog. Slowly. We are no match for muscular aggressive Islam especially in the face of the numerous home grown useful idiots that dance to their tune.
“Islam is the broom of Israel”
Again, what a bigoted joke to suggest that liberal Jews somehow have more responsibility than the far more numerous number of non-Jewish liberals in the Western world, including the U.S. I mean, if “Barbara Spector et al” said this or that, that’s proof dem Jews were behind it all.
They (we?) are massively represented in the media and academia , you must admit A soupçon of mea culpa may be in order from western liberals of all backgrounds .
Imagine these same conversations around the camp fires in the prairie lands of North America,among the Sioux,Lakota,Dakota,Cherokee,Navajo et al. This is a huge land,theres room for us all. Their religion is one of kindness and love. Don’t worry.
La Spectre was home grown in New York , then Israel and started educating us on the necessary future of Europe from her perch in Sweden , during that country’s aspiration to be a ‘moral superpower’ phase.
It is odd though, is it not, that wherever Jews go trouble follows.. they are a tiny minority of the world’s population.
Chinese and Indians spread all over (even us Irish too) and all seem to assimilate fine.. but then we don’t think we’re God’s chosen few and the rest are substandard. Maybe that’s the problem? After all, Jews (who didn’t think* that way?) lived in harmony with Muslims and Christians for hundreds of years in Ottoman ruled Palestine.
*I suspect the majority told their Jewish neighbours that was a no-no.
Holy crao dude! You’re an awful antisemite.
Oh rubbish, why can’t the Jews be criticised? It is not hate speech it is just an opinion, I think you lot just hate Muslims and know very little about them, is that racism or bigotry I am confused? Sounds like the left and the Unherd right are ALL indulging in censorship
“why can’t the Jews be criticised?”.
Perhaps because they are the self-styled “chosen people”?
So mere opinions can’t be hate speech ?
Pure unadulterated (and woefully ignorant) Jew-hate.
Hey dudes,we all gotta Lurve Everee-b-o-d-eeee,peace and love man
What would you know Harry, you’re not very bright are you… So you think Jews are lovely and Muslims are bad do you?
I know right! Those contemptible Jews throwing acid into children’s faces, ramming cars into people, blowing up concert-goers, throwing old ladies out of windows, molesting young girls, stabbing writers in their eyeballs, blowing up buildings, beheading teachers, and crashing planes into cities. Islam is the Religion of Peace and death to all who disagree!
Being one rung above slave is hardly peace and harmony. As much of an ahistorical joke as “Irish assimilation”.
How do you know someone is Irish? Wait five seconds and they’ll tell you.
As it happens ,Liam , it’s the Irish Travellers who are notorious for criminality and antisocial behaviour .
Liam o’mahony, you need to qualify your assertion Jews experienced peace in Ottoman Palestine, to acknowledge at the least, the Hebron massacre of 1517.
The Ottomans were imperialists anyway . I thought woke Liam hated imperialists
They were imperialists, colonisers, and slaveholders! If I recall correctly, the Ottoman corsairs, also known as Barbary pirates, sailed all the way up to southern Ireland where they raided entire villages and either murdered or enslaved the poor residents. The Sack of Baltimore in West Cork comes to mind as a famous example…
Spoken like a true anti semitic. You’re not even bothering to hide your views any more.
All those “Who Do You Think You Are?” Pop tv genealogical investigations that ended up in somewhere in Middle Europe ending in “witz”. To be blessed and chosen by God is a dubious and uncomfortable honour.
See above
Besides Soros, Barbara Lerner Spector, Count Coudenhove-Kalergi, and Jewish progressives who have called for open borders, which Jews are “behind this”?
Go online and type in “anti-white”
Go F yourself.
Is that the best you can do?
Well The Yahoo don’t give us much confidence thinking he’s Joshua smiting Amalekites,thou shalt kill them all,even their children,their slaves,their animals. If you let one survive I will punish you. “OK boss”.
Wasn’t SMITE the word?
Are you seriously suggesting this is all down to a relative few Jewish liberals, who, after all, are far far outnumbered by non-Jewish liberals, who believed precisely the same things.
They ALL own and control the entertainment industry which is how they get toxic pernicious ideas into the mainstream of public thought.
Don’t forget the ‘Counting Houses’, sometimes misleading called Banks.
This is forum hosts a number of Qanon, David Icke followers. Knuckledraggers who hate the jews in remarkably similar ways to unhinged islamists. They are a minority but they exist.
If only western politicians had the wit to consider millennia or arabic history before bombing their nations!
So very true.
The lack of Leadership is not only appalling, it is sterile,incompetent and worst of all cowardly !
Great essay to start the week – spot on in all respects. These two sentences in particular were brilliantly written and full of the truth that no one dares speak:
“Faced with the arrival of a new community with such a strong belief system, Europe’s political elites sought refuge in the soft bigotry of low expectations. Denying them agency, we shrouded Muslim immigrants in a rhetoric of victimhood.”
I’ve long had the feeling that the only way to redress the balance in this respect is through some highly illiberal assimilation measures. The idea that you need such illiberalism in order to maintain your liberal society is going to blow the minds of all those who can’t hold two contradictory ideas in their heads at once.
“I’ve long had the feeling that the only way to redress the balance in this respect is through some highly illiberal assimilation measures.”
Correct Katharine. We have got to the point where good-people-go-bad and start contemplating the unthinkable. There are dark mutterings from people of something needing to be done and I suspect this will spark a change soon. I hate it’s come to this.
I worry about that “bigotry of low expectations” bit. Too often that sort of sentiment is expressed by people who want to show that they are not just concerned about mass immigration but also about the welfare of the migrants. In a similar moral vein we will be told that illegal migration should be discouraged because it is dangerous for the migrants.
Is talk of soft bigotry supposed to expose our elites as guilty of unconscious bias? It is an irrelevance when we should be discussing the fact that they have created politically privileged classes of people who cannot even be criticised with impunity. That is a serious danger to the wider community.
By the way, my local neighbourhood is now so extensively peopled with migrants that I am left with the question: to what culture are all these people supposed to integrate and assimilate?
Don’t forget that those low expectations are also projected onto Muslim majority countries, who are often ahead of the West in banning Islamic extremist groups.
Read Tom Holland ‘s “Dominion”. It’s the Christian ethic which has defined the West for 2000 years, but so few realize that if a society is now post Christian then it started by being at least somewhat Christian. The West is Christian in a profound sense in which Jesus teachings are so endemic that you don’t even need to believe in him to be a follower of his ways. The key is to go back to our Christian roots and find out where we went off track. Everyone needs to re learn Western Civ
Classical Civilisation predates Jesus and his motley crew by quite some margin.
It provided the necessary matrix for the Nazarene and his illogical cult to flourish, much to the detriment of society in general it must be sadly said.
The rise of FAITH and the fall of REASON to put it bluntly.
“By the way, my local neighbourhood is now so extensively peopled with migrants that I am left with the question: to what culture are all these people supposed to integrate and assimilate?”
A growing number of schools in Vienna now have more than 50% of kids with a migration background – many of whom only speak German at school. Only speaking German for a couple of hours a day isn’t enough to attain the grades and academic standards necessary to get a good job here…you can imagine the societal split and tension that we’re going to have 10-15 years down the line when these groups of immigrants are still sitting, struggling at the bottom of society in low-paid, low-qualified jobs.
Plus, the ones who aren’t properly up to the task of school are dragging the other kids down. I’ve heard that parents from the ex-Yugoslavia are taking their kids out of schools in my area, because they fear their little ones won’t be able to learn German there and not get on in this new and lovely life their parents came here to give them. Migrants are avoiding other migrants, for goodness’ sake, it’s so absurd!
And yet you still have people wringing their hands over fairly mild stuff like introducing an obligation to speak German at school and in the playground. To talk about things like this is, of course, FAR RIGHT.
I’m starting to favour having a sorting process in the pre-school year (when kids are about 5) to check which kids can speak the language well enough to cope with school. If they can’t, they can be put through a compulsory pre-school year where their language skills are brought up to par. This can be done in quite a playful way I guess, but there would have to be strict supervision by adults to make sure the kids speak German all the time they are there. Kids at that age soak up the language like little sponges so they’d be ready to take on proper school lessons afterwards.
However, that doesn’t solve the problem of the attitude at home towards the host society and education in general and how that impacts on a kid’s education, integration and long-term prospects.
It’s a veritable Pandora’s box.
You should study the Residential School program for indigenous children in Canada and see the uproar it has caused in the past twenty years.
Indeed. And your illiberal assimilation measures would be projected by the likes of the BBC as ‘Far-Right’ assimilation measures.
Is the answer for the illiberals to take ownership of ‘Far-Right’? Similar to the way some in the Gay community are now proudly owning ‘queer’?
For a tolerant society to survive it is essential that all its intolerant elements are eliminated.
Exactly! Bigotry against bigotry isn’t bigotry, and tolerance of intolerance isn’t tolerance. Intolerant attitudes that are unacceptable in general life shouldn’t suddenly become acceptable when presented under the guise of religion.
Ever since Philip of Macedon, Europe’s ruling elites have made no secret (i.e. no conspiracy) of their fondness for divide and rule as the way to maintain their power. It has taken many forms, but in recent decades in the UK, it has taken the form of mass immigration, combined with so-called “multiculturalism” (a more descriptive terminology being “deliberate non-assimilation”). Thus Islamism is not best characterised as an unfortunate by-product of open borders. Rather, it should be viewed as the sort of phenomenon that elites look for when they want to exploit divisions. So far, this manifestation of divide and rule has been quite successful for the elite (though not for the rest of us). But it is beginning to look like the elite has mis-judged the situation and has lost control. The Islamist tail is increasingly wagging the dog.
An insightful read.
Unfortunately, Aayan Hirsi Ali’s perfected argument is completely disarmed with a simple cry of “Islamophobia!”
Islamicists are masterful in positioning themselves as the underdogs, and that’s precisely the one thing that takes control of the mind of every liberal on the planet.
The sooner that people realise the word “Islamophobia” is a propaganda term (and a very effective one indeed), designed to protect Islam from all scrutiny and criticism by secular societies, the better.
A question to those in our society who decry anti-Semitism, yet still insist Diversity is our greatest strength: Who do you imagine poses the greater threat to the safety of Jews in this country? Do you imagine the problem is more home-grown, or imported?
As the situation in Gaza deteriorates we will see a flood of people looking to settle in Western cities. Well-meaning, wooly liberals will suggest it is our duty to offer shelter to these poor unfortunates.
If you are a child growing up in Gaza or the West Bank, this is what you get to watch on TV:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lZ27fj2XNM It beggars belief
Having spent your young life being thusly indoctrinated, and having those same messages reinforced by your parents, your teachers, your community and religious leaders, is it any surprise that the violence continues generation after generation? What, honestly, are the chances of someone with that mindset assimilating into European culture? Fitting in with values of tolerance and religious freedom?
If such indoctrinated youngsters are – in the name of compassion – relocated here, who thinks that Europe’s Jewish communities will be safer as a result?
We’ve seen Stars of David daubed on the front doors of Jewish homes in Berlin recently. We’ve seen a Dagestani mob storm an airport to “Hunt for Jews”. Every weekend has seen mass protests and rallies across the West in support of Palestine and against Israel, against Jews.
After any Islamist attack or atrocity, our Political leaders rush in front of the camera to insist that such attacks have “nothing to do with Islam”. How do they know? Because, they assure us, “Islam is a religion of Peace”. Govts of Western liberal democracies have tried to ignore the fact that Islamist atrocities are explicitly committed in the name of their faith.
The state seems reluctant to admit this obvious fact for fear of upsetting Muslim communities. Obviously, the vast majority of Muslims do not condone such atrocities, though it is a real problem so many seem reluctant to condemn their co-religionists publicly.
There are plenty of people – it might well be the majority of the population – who have concerns that mainstream Muslim opinion on a number of issues is categorically at odds with what the rest of us might deem basic, liberal values – but it is an extraordinary leap to go from that evident and demonstrable truth to get to the idea that any such criticism thus constitutes “Islamophobia”.
Not being free to discuss that point is, itself, a real problem and only provides cover in which more fundamentalist Islamic extremism can flourish in our midst, unchallenged.
Thanks for that YouTube link. Quite shocking and it does make you wonder what kind of educational material Muslim children in Britain may be exposed to.
And when the Islamists run out of Jews to target, where else might they look? You may be right about “the vast majority of Muslims,” but over time, their silence starts to look like approval.
Islam is a problem for the Labour party. It depends on the Muslim vote. However there will be a time when muslim demands cannot be met by Labour. Its happening now with the pro Palistinian demonstrations. The fear of being seen as ‘Islamaphobic’ led to the situation where many Labour local authorities turned a blind eye to the sexual abuse of young white girls. The Labour party , and indeed the country, need to stand firm against the tide of Islamic demands. These demands often don’t sit well with a Liberal democracy.
Excellent comment. A mere quibble, but I’d remove the word “often” from your concluding sentence.
The tolerance and generally peaceful attitude of the West has always been its greatest strength, but like all strengths taken too far, they have become its most profound and quite possibly fatal weakness.
Sorry, but what I see isn’t a sudden surge of islamic fans, is just plain common sense and compassion towards the massive killing of people who happens to be in a place another people want for themselves. I’m so sick of the absolute surrendering of Europe to this massacre.
Where is the compassion toward the victims of widespread slaughter carried out by Muslims – against other Muslims and anyone else – from the Middle East to Africa? A one religion crime wave has swept over several nations in Europe and it’s not being carried out by the Catholics, the Baptists, the Buddhists, the Hindus, or the Jews.
Israelis are not the only “people who happen to be in a place another people want for themselves”. Uyghurs, Syrians, Rohingya, Kurds, Ukrainians, Armenians and peoples across sub-saharan Africa are similarly persecuted. Europe is powerless to intervene in all these tragedies.
Wonderfully expressed! Thanks!
As an aside but apropos, if in NYC, do catch a performance of the off- Broadway production of “Prayers for the French Republic.”
I’m guessing you’re in it.
Fundamentally, the problem is of people of the Left from the 70s and 80s telling these parties they’ve given up their core values then returning to them precisely when they see power. The secondary problem is that these New Left politics have now been passed down to generation Y and Z in terms of the new governing liberal bourgeoisie.
As I understand it, compared to Judaism and Sikhism for example, who do not seek to create converts, Islam and Christianity look to convert anyone it can to their religion (hence crusades, jihad and the relatively low numbers globally of Jews and Sikhs. This explains the numbers of believers in the world, and why so many Muslims from various places come or have come to Europe to a better life. (Happy to be corrected if this is wrong)
Christianity however has for a long time now embraced the idea of separation of church and state, whereas Islam has not…but if what Hirsi Ali says here is true and reflects this, can someone please explain why Muslim societies of antiquity (ancient Baghdad for example) were relatively benign and tolerant? As far as I know, Jews and Christians lives in these places and could hold positions of power, not to mention the legendary libraries and universities, mathematical advances etc. I just don’t know why modern Islam is written about in such reactionary and illiberal terms when historically it wasn’t always this way. Would appreciate some insight.
I think the book by famed historian Bernard Lewis, “What Went Wrong” are among those required reading to get an answer to your question
Many thanks for reply, will check out cheers
Some strands of Christianity actively seek converts or recruits, but not all.
The Orthodox for example are very much against the concept.
Creating converts … Islam uses the sword, Christians the book.
As to why Muslims continue to flood into Europe, it’s for the free kaffir welfare on offer, lax islam-friendly policing, an easily intimidated kaffir political class (which will be put to the sword when the time is right), and of course the dream of the global Umma.
Perhaps because modern Islam is reactionary and illiberal?
we should be encouraging Muslim minorities to integrate and embrace Dutch values.
What a remarkably sad testament to the quality of political leadership that this has to be said out loud. It is the exact problem being faced across the Atlantic, where Spanish-only enclaves have allowed to develop and where more, perhaps with more languages, will follow. The one-time melting pot is no more, replaced by an incoherent salad bowl whose already-apparent problems will only be magnified with time.
The world knows that these Muslim minorities in the final analysis do not integrate. Not that there is anything wrong with that, except where they have evil intent.
How long did it take to route and eject all the muslims from Spain in 1492. Their raison d’etre is sharia law and conquest it would appear. In fact the history of the moors immigrating to Spain is an interesting historical study.
The Bishop of Dover describes the Channel migrants as ‘our brothers, sisters and mothers’.
This sort of Christianity has Jesus of Nazareth as the wish-fulfilment of the believer’s egalitarian and social justice creed.
The hymn Onward Christian Soldiers is now never sung in churches of the Church of England. In any other context turning a blind eye and a deaf ear would be denounced as appeasement.
Starmer can call – aren’t there so many ‘calls’ for this and that, like yodelling across a Swiss valley – for a ceasefire in Gaza with confidence, knowing that he will never be called upon to provide the details and that these ‘calls’ have no effect on the events concerned. A ‘ceasefire that lasts’ could be creating a desert of concrete dust and calling it peace.
It will take a long time for the Muslim voters in the UK to realise that these legacy political parties will never represent their concerns in this regard, no matter how else they are accommodated.
“Emmanuel Macron is now doing his best to talk tough on Islam” is obviously a gaff (correct word being Islamism). It is crucial in such discussions to distinguish between terms.
Islam is to Islamist what Judaism is to Zionism or what Christianity is to modern Western (genocidal, colonial, racial) attitudes.
The plain simple facts are:
1: If People lived up to the primary principles of their faiths be they Muslim, Christian or Jew NONE of the problems being discussed would even exist!
2: Fundamentalism (focus on the aggressive tenets of all three religions) is the problem, ie a twisted and/or highly selective version of their true teachings.
3: Fundamentalist Islamism is the enemy of Muslims as much as, if not more than it is the enemy of Christians or other non Muslims.
One reason Integration works in America much better than the UK is the simple fact that America doesn’t have an Indiginous racist population – the are ALL immigrants.
Another reason is the UK, because of its deep set racism, lumps all Muslims together and assumes they’re all Islamists at heart; which is as stupid as assuming all Christians are alike and all Zionist/Colonialist/Evangelist nutjobs. This results in the UK focusing on attacking Islamists instead of nurturing ties with moderate Muslims with its anti Muslim rhetoric thereby driving those moderate Muslims into the arms of Islamists. Totally counterproductive!
The UK did the same in NI: alienated moderate Nationalists by assuming all were IRA supporters: the result? Many DID become IRA supporters because they had nowhere else to your! ..a self-fulfilling prophesy.
So the problem isn’t the jihadis, the grooming gang operators, and the criminals; it’s the people who notice the jihadis, the grooming gangs, and the criminals. At what point, considering that such a point exists, might we expect the moderate Muslims to corral their not-so-moderate brethren? Oddly, the West has no issue speaking out against its own outliers, be they the BLM crowd, antifa, or whatever passes as ‘far right’ these days. But one never sees the moderates doing much of anything. Instead, we have a stream of apologists who defend the jihadis, cover for the grooming gangs, and support the criminals.
USA is not more integrated than the UK at all, on many metrics the UK is one of the least racist and most tolerant countries in the world, whereas as recently as WWII enlisted black men in the US Army could not mix with their white colleagues, and there were diplomatic arguments and incidents when black US Army soldiers were welcomed into UK pubs and the homes of white families against US government wishes. As one of many examples. Sorry to go off topic but your claims are simply not true.
The NI stuff is frequently brought up by Irish as a comparison to Gaza/Isreal but the IRA didn’t ever systematically rape British women or behead British babies as far as I know. Different level of barbarity, NI not relevant or helpful here.
I think the end game for many Muslims is to make any criticism of Islam illegal. We already have a de – facto blasphemy law when it comes to muslims. Upset the sensibilities of Muslims and you will subjected to the islamic mob, and possibly worse. They are putting pressure on schools to drop certain lessons. They want to set the curriculum. Don’t forget there is a teacher who is still in hiding because he showed a dipiction Allah to his pupils.
Erm, not really.
It’s the party’s willingness to appease their major donors – who are certainly not “Islamists” – that is driving Muslim reaction to Western nations’ unconditional support for the Israeli far-Right’s mass murder.
Was it a mistake to allow/invite millions of Muslims into Western nations? Sure. Was it a mistake not to enforce assimilation? Yes. (and you could also say the same about the Judaic extremists known as Zionists).
But the Muslims are here now, and no amount of mealy-mouthed platitudes about Israel having a “right to defend itself” is going to placate them when they see corralled Palestinian children being blown apart with Western weapons.
“We” can either stop supporting Israel, or face serious unrest from a significant minority of our populations. Whining about Islamists now is a horses/stable door territory.
I’m sure that behind your populist bluster (for that is what it is in your circles) you know that what you say is not true. Of course the Labour Party needs its Muslim votes. The war in Gaza is stress testing the resilience of the non Muslim world against the Hamas strategy of putting children in harms way so that you can make your populist statements. Hamas corrals them. It’s going really well.
Hamas didn’t build the walls and machine guns that corral the Palestinian children into the killing fields.
Try again.
No it was done with the equally impenetrable walls of ‘indoctrination’ in the schools.
The people who taught Gazans to hate Israelis are the Israelis themselves.
Having an oppressor take your land, burn your olive groves, shoot your relatives in the back and flatten your homes with Western ordnance will do that to a people.
Zionism is a hateful, racial supremacist ideology, so don’t be surprised when its victims respond in kind.
Air-headed do-gooder bourgeois liberals opened the floodgates for Muslims into Europe, against everyone else’s objections. Except for liberal fools, nobody thought Muslims would assimilate into a culture they see as profane and inferior. It’s on liberals, nobody else.
Due to Islam’s program of total, zero-sum, uncompromising domination, there’ll be bloodshed all across Europe in the future, no matter what course is taken. Do nothing, and when the Islamists judge it’s the right time, they’ll slaughter anyone in their way. Or push back, and it’ll be a struggle to the death. There’ll be no “oh well, they’re here now, let’s all be liberal and just tolerate the rapes and murders, just think how bad the Jews are too,” like you suggest. Islam won’t stop just because you want to throw Israel under the bus.
Also, what’s “mealy mouthed” about self-defense against bullies openly and repeatedly declaring that they will murder you and your family? Obviously, you’ll be massacred if you don’t fight back. It’s that in-your-face. That’s how the world outside liberal la-la land has always worked, unfortunately. You seem very sheltered to not know that.
So, expel all Muslims? What about Judaists? Do we expel them all too?
PS – I’m not a liberal Jew
Now is the time for the first past the post system to be changed. It is a danger that it can be captured by extremists. Instead of holding one or other parties to ransom there will be an incentive to create new parties that feel they have a say in the governing of the country but in truth will always be ganged upon by the more centrist alliances.
Run offs if no one achieves 50% is the best policy.
Why do Muslims prefer to live in Western democracies and not Islamic states
What is the attraction?
To conquer.
Oh, and the free kaffir welfare — aka jizya.
Been a huge fan of Ayaan Hirsi Ali since her book, Infidel. The only thing I’d add to this essay is a consideration of the contributions of Western business interest vis a vis the advent of Islamic migrations to some European countries (especially Germany) in the 1960’s and 1970’s. The Gastarbeiter program, e.g. brought in mostly Turkish laborers to do the unpleasant jobs the native Germans has grown too prosperous to consider as well as an bolster the shrinking native labor force due to anemic birth rates. It was the nose of the camel poking under the tent and served as the template inspiring subsequent economic migrants from Africa and the Middle East. That first wave of migrants were not admitted under the banner of multiculturalism, which had not yet entered our vocabulary, but as an economic expedient, i.e. cheap labor.
The globalization of business, and the advent of multiculturalism poured fuel on this fire by necessitating cheaper sources of labor in Europe and the US to counter the off-shoring of industry to the inexpensive labor markets of the far east. Big business off-shored, but small businesses that could not manufacture overseas needed cheap labor to compete and were complicit with loose immigration policy as an economic remedy. As the Baby Boom completed college the bloated higher education systems in the west refused to shrink and increasingly looked off-shore for students, who often never returned home. Consequently, for several decades there existed a convergence of Western pro-immigration policy favored by both business and liberal intelligentsia over the objections of the Western working class.
I don’t get why this turns into an argument that atheism opens the door to Islamism.
My biggest complaint against religion is how it was such a missed opportunity, dressing up wonderful wisdom in this ridiculous fantasy of a supernatural. As people realised that it’s caused them to throw the baby (the wise lessons) out with the fantastic story bathwater, leaving no strong belief to stand against this medieval, brutal faith. Now I’m sorry to say that the process is nearing completion and at some point there’ll be very nasty pushback.
i read Powells famous speech yesterday. Seriously prescient. Even though I disagree with many of his specific opinions it’s hard to credit this speech is 55 years old. He certainly calls it right about how politicians prefer not to face up to problems they can kick into the future.
Good summary of the problem with religion.
There’s been mention in recent years of the need for an ‘Islamic Reformation’ but i suspect it’s not something that’s likely to happen for generations, if at all.
The left is rooted in atheism, is that so hard to understand? The left allied itself with Islam to undermine the foundations of the West. There, that’s even easier to understand..
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What a sane and sensible assessment of the overriding threat to the multicultural, morally relative and hollowed-out secular West. Islam has your number, chaps, and the game is just about over. The Conservatives let you down, Labour will do worse. The only one standing between you and the muezzin’s cry from every desanctified Christian church is Nigel Farage. Not very encouraging, is it? He is not Christ taking a whip to the money changers in the temple, but he’s the best you’ve got.
a clear and concise overview thankyou Ayaan – i do hope you end up in a civilized relatively peaceful part of the planet one day – you deserve that !! NZ ??
Unfortunately the West has generally lost real Christianity that could attract, absorb and change communities and people in it, with no force – even if they are idol worshippers of Greece or Rome in early centuries. Few in the West, again generally speaking, go to church on Sundays, and a bit more on Christmas and Easter, etc. NOT that it is Christianity, but there’s nothing left of it, just a skeleton and empty pride, colluded with relativism and guilt for colonialist policies of the past, and fear of NOT being on the culturally correct side of society!
Here’s my 2 cents for better understanding what we had and is mostly lost in the west, and the way to regain it, I recommend “Cities of God” or “The Rise Of Christianity” by Rodney Stark; “Divine Conspiracy” by the late philosopher, writer Dallas Willard, and some of the good material from N.T.Wright like “Surprised by Hope“…
What’s with all this ‘Islamism’? How’s it different from Islam? Is there ‘Christianism’?
‘Denying them agency, we shrouded Muslim immigrants in a rhetoric of victimhood.’
Don’t think so, think the western press actually painted them as terrorists repeatedly in the news to justify the invasion of Iraq and such.
The rhetoric of victimhood, if they did apply it, helped justify the export of western values to the middle east and……well how well did that go?
‘Rules were relaxed, standards were lowered, and excuses were made whenever their estrangement tipped over into violence.’
Not sure that’s entirely true either. Actually we introduced the first legislation against ‘hate speech’ as far as I remember and continued to paint them as terrorists in the press. Started the never ending ‘war on terror’. Got a whole division of ‘anti terrorist police’.
‘This is, after all, what happens when a nation’s foundational principles are eroded — and when, faced with a moral and political vacuum, Islamism is the only potent force in town.’
Our foundational principles include freedom of religion. So sorry but if people want to be Islamic that is up to them. You can’t have it both ways.
Divisive article. Not sure it’s even based in reality.
I would like to add: Why the f*ck has this gone straight to moderation?
Deep factual analysis as always. Agree with everything you say.
There is, however, one unspoken reason the US is genuinely to blame. In the space that was seen as a golden opportunity to repay Russia after the Soviet fall in 1991 for centuries of anti-Semitism and alignment with Iran and Syria et al, and the Cold War, and to rightly fight back against 9/11, and to not lose the Cold War peace by reintegrating Russia with Europe free of charge, US initiatives spilled these millions of immigrants into Europe (which as you say was naive enough to accept them). And as for that historic front line that held a militarily conquering Islam from Europe, the Balkans, the US even aligned with a rabid political pan-Islamist in Bosnia whose Mein Kampf was his Islamic Declaration. Brought in jihadists freed from Afghanistan and North Africa, and arms from Iran, via Peter Galbraith and Paul Neitze in Zagreb, illegally around the UN arms embargo. Is forcing Kosovo into a Greater Albania. All targeting that competitor and historic enemy, Russia. And now this new war. So, there’s something to perhaps analyse a little more closely, if you dare. Inadvisable, because then you’re between two sets of equally psychopathic opponents. As a word to the wise, not a good place. And yet Russia, China and the US were in the goodwill after the Cold War allies in this existential struggle you so accurately portray.
Tolerance of difficult minorities and the ignoring of obvious societal fracture lines is easy when there is (relative) plenty. Emergency Planners talk about ‘three meals from anarchy’ (which may originally have been a quote from Lenin). In other words, a modern westernised society descends into chaos after three meals have been missed! (Only three!). That is when difficult minorities and societal fracture lines are no longer tolerated, resulting possibly in ‘rivers of blood’ (whose quote was that?). Events that might lead to three missed meals are all around us: Covid nearly did it, general war in Europe or Southeast Asia would certainly do it, a ragtag bunch of (Islamist) Houthi rebels are trying their best to do it.
Why don’t you research your quotes instead of asking where they came from? Pure laziness is my guess.
Thank you for your comment. I did research the quotation, but it is ‘variously ascribed’. In 1906 Alfred Henry Lewis, an American journalist spoke about any society being ‘9 meals from chaos.’ Whilst Lenin also made a similar point, some sources quote him saying ‘3 meals…’, whilst others suggest ‘9 meals…..’. Nevertheless, I felt that the spirit of these quotations illustrated my point. I hope this helps.
Banning Islam and mass deportations back to Islamic countries is the only solution.
Yup
Yup, indeed!
The spiritual leader of Islam is, I believe Ishmael the son of Hagar and Abraham. Hagar was banished and gave birth to Ishmael who was supposedly the first born of the Arab people
to quote “Ishmael; he would grow up to be a “wild ass of a man,” in constant struggle with all other men” Thus the culture that Islam developed into warrior religion.
My goodness, what a perfect example of partisan thinking from a writer who has recently nailed her colours to a different religious mast. She is literally saying that Islam is ‘bad’ because ‘that’s not the way we do things round here’; the ‘truth’ is that all religions are in error as to the facts of existence yet most of them have some value as metaphorical guidelines for pre-scientific thinkers.
Cultural hegemony is a way to conquer a nation. Our political leaders treat muslim immigrants with European standards as if they would embrace our values grown out of christianity and enlightenment or now postmodernism. How naive or stupid.
I’m reminded of GK Chesterton’s comment that ““When men choose not to believe in God, they do not thereafter believe in nothing, they then become capable of believing in anything.”Whether it’s ‘God’ they’re not believing in or simply the virtues of civic society, fanaticism fills the gap instead.
As she brings it up, it’s worth reminding everyone that Ali resigned as a Dutch MP when a local Panorama-type TV documentary series exposed that she had made up most of the claims of abuse she had used to get citizenship and gain notoriety there. Everyone has a right to a second chance and all that, but do bare this in mind when she’s spouting off against Islam on these pages.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali, the Somali-born Dutch American activist, writer, and politician, gained Dutch citizenship after receiving political asylum in the Netherlands. She moved across various countries in Africa and the Middle East before settling in the Netherlands, where she adjusted her name to Ayaan Hirsi Ali and successfully applied for political asylum. She studied political science at the State University of Leiden and later worked as a researcher on immigration issues for the centre-left Labour Party (Partij van de Arbeid; PvdA). During her time with the party, she became known for her sharp criticism of both Islam and the Dutch government’s immigration policies. Although her Dutch citizenship faced controversy, she ultimately retained it and later moved to the United States, where she became a U.S. citizen in 2013
However, it’s worth noting that in 2006, the immigration minister announced that her Dutch citizenship was illegitimate due to false statements she had made on her asylum and citizenship applications. Despite this, she continued to hold Dutch citizenship. Later, in 2009, the Dutch Immigration Minister decided to revoke her citizenship because she had made incorrect statements on her Dutch asylum application.
She recently became a Christian, is married to Niall Ferguson and remain an important voice in the anti-muslim controversy.
“It is no coincidence that the European surge in Islamism came just as the continent’s dechristianisation began to take hold.” A very questionable assertion given how many Christian leaders side with Islam against both religions’ secular critics.
Another excellent piece from Ms. Ali. My only quibble is with the assertion that America “is, after all, the nation that birthed the mantra of multiculturalism.”
America is the nation that birthed the mantra of the melting pot, and that’s quite different from multiculturalism. If there is a birthplace for the mantra of multiculturalism, that’s likely Canada, which introduced it as government policy in 1971, followed by Australia in 1973.
It’s the differences in the melting pot approach of the U.S. versus the multiculturalism approach of Canada and much of western Europe that actually gives me more hope for the U.S. on this.
As a tourist, I was recently in Ireland, UK and several west European countries. What was similar in all of these places was that, on a sunny day, the town center is filled with crowds of laughing, smoking and coffee-drinking young Middle Eastern and African men, all talking and playing with their iPhones. The less numerous local white Europeans, most of them 20 – 40 years older the chatting cellphone users, can be seen going about their daily work. Who will be around in the coming decades to own and dominate these nice tourist places?
“ without realising that, in doing so, they were allowing this process of Islamisation to take root.” The architects of this plan knew exactly what they were doing but they couldn’t have done it without an army of clueless but willing and highly useful idiots.
“we should be encouraging Muslim minorities to integrate and embrace Dutch values.”
What are those “Dutch values?” Atheism, legalized drug-use, pornography, homosexuality and self-loathing?
The problem is I don’t think Islam considers itself a religion that will assimilate and respect the country it’s in. Islam is a world religion that at it’s peak was conquering and converting Africans into their religion. Our constitution protects the Quran but the Quran does not want to protect the constitution.
Well said.
The Quran, according to its adherents, is above secular law! Hence, the followers are bound to go against secular law if it conflicts with what is written in the Quran.
Insightful but research does not necessarily suggest Muslims in Europe ‘support Islamism’. For example the Pew Research survey shared by Ali where she says “ survey after survey showed that most Muslims quietly supported the belief system that justified the terrorists’ activities” was only carried out on Muslims living in ‘the Muslim world’ of the ME and N.Africa. In fact, it explicitly states that most Muslims in these countries do not believe that sharia law (which was the subject of the survey) should be applied to non-Muslims.
Let’s address the spiritual vacuum and political limpness highlighted by Ali, but without resorting to histrionics and baseless assumptions about people.
I wish people would write intelligent commentary on the article instead of garbage about the comments other people make. This is tedious.
What a strange comment to make. Have you been drinking?
You should have noticed that this is a forum where readers debate with one another as well as merely commenting on the article. In a way the article functions as a starting point for broader discussion. The level of discussion is mostly intelligent and civil. It is neither garbage nor tedious.
Is the concern here that muslim families have a birth rate that is triple that of ethnic Europeans. Thus in a relatively short space of time they are going to be in the majority. The other issue here is that European families have for the most part become very secular whereas muslim families are very faithful adherents to their faith.
Saturday 24th February, 21:45
Tower Bridge is currently blocked by a massive anti-Israel demonstration demanding A Ceasefire Now! to stop what the protestors have convinced themselves is genocide. This sort of protest gives the false impression that the nation is rising up in outrage at Israel when of course it is usual alliance of Islamists, the Israel-hating Left and know-nothing virtue-signallers.
Now where is that silent majority of “moderate Muslims” who we are told do not condone this sort of thing?
It looks like the British don’t exist anymore.
The doctrines of Islam are plain to see in the Quran and Hadith. They are flourishing on our streets, Mosques, homes and occasionally cathedrals (Hagua Sophia being an example). Its objectives and purpose are clear. It is to humanity’s benefit that we embrace the Islamic life and the Prophet’s (pbh) teaching. Our men will be empowered, women protected from vice and children healthy. Politics will be cleansed from corruption and religion respected. The sooner it is embraced the sooner our society benefits. Peace be upon you.
I am curious to know what age-group you belong to, assuming you are not being ironic. To see why watch Niall Ferguson’s talk.
The term Islamism is redundant, the word is Islam.
The ‘top’ comments seem to bear no relationship to the subject of the essay. Only William Brand addresses this and it is hard to know whether he is serious. If I can take the liberty of steering a little to one side, may I suggest what makes Islam different.
Brand refers to just the lunatic fringe of Christianity which (repeatedly) interprets its apocalypse as ongoing, whereas in reality it foundered when the rebellion against the Romans in 66-70 CE failed to bring about the end of the world. The solid content of Christianity is in the Gospels and Paul’s letters, which it is argued represent different and sometimes opposing parties, one dedicated to fulfilling the law and prophecies, see e.g. the Sermon on the Mount, the other emphasising faith, almost without content.
The latter has survived better into at least the European mainstream because much of the ‘law’ is either unexceptional (expressing Jewish Pharisaic mores of the time) or extraneous (like the prohibition of marrying a divorced woman). Jesus remains a vague figure, his sayings second or more probably third hand, which is why churchmen and increasingly women can keep churning out new interpretations and angles.
Conversely, whether or not Jesus really claimed to be ‘messiah’, i.e. legitimate king of Judah in the line of David, people can ascribe to certain moral codes or beliefs about how to treat others, the immaterial soul (not an original feature of Jewish thought), life after death, or distant eschatology, without compromising their political and national loyalties. Churchgoers apparently see no contradiction in worshipping a ‘king’ or ‘lord’ while enjoying the fruits of secular democracy and rational enquiry.
Islam is quite different. Its holy books are treated as first hand records of the Word of God transmitted through the Prophet. Though the Prophet died in 632 CE, his personality, mind and will live on in the Qur’an and Hadith. It is as though these represent the Prophet himself, which is why inter alia there was such a fuss about the ’Qur’an scuffing’ incident, and why Muslims are so sensitive about criticism of their faith. However much Muslims may affirm their commitment to democracy and plurality, there is ultimately no place for compromise nor room for alternative authority. Accepting either of these would effectively render Islam devoid of authority, even meaning.
Therein lies the threat of Islam to secular democracy in any of its many variations, or for that matter any other system of thought, whose plurality reflects the fact that we cannot know everything, or ‘know the mind of God’, or write anything down ‘without error’. Islam is in effect the cult of a personality who is now beyond reach of criticism or even question. Cults come and go in evangelical Christianity, and as minority affairs are largely harmless except to their members. Islam is something of a different order.
On the topic of moral vacuum, there are few ethical principles that can be derived from nature in the broadest sense. David Hume showed that ‘Ought’ cannot be derived absolutely from ‘Is’. Practical moral principles will be contingent to an extent. Research into the moral priorities of various communities has not supported what one might call ‘Christian’ values. For example, fairness came bottom, respect for property and kin loyalty being rated highest, though avoiding conflict is a common theme. However, the appalling history of the 20th century, and the current senselessly destructive conflicts, show that the moral vacuum needs to be filled urgently. This is a difficult problem. Just consider, what would a society look like in which it has been resolved? By the way, well worth listening to Niall Ferguson, who is married to Ayaan Hirsi Ali, in his YouTube talk ‘After the treason of the intellectuals’.