Bit of utopian wistfulness and cod-psychology in the writing of the article, and if you want crazy communes look to Russia where they do the craziest, and at least one of them, the Doukhobors, have kept it going since the 1600s, and are still kicking around in Canada, likely still ready to mass march nude and burn down government buildings, as that is their traditional protest when messed with….
But….the commune memories still are so strong in me, from back around 1980, when I lived in a truly wonderful one……
I had left London after dropping out of school and became a drifter, a ‘Road Freak’, living out of a pack and hitch hiking dirt poor for many years when I stumbled onto a tiny commune in Oregon, and stayed through most of the winter, and it was the happiest time of my life. There were no jobs of any kind so I spent all day walking a dozen miles a day collecting scrap and deposit bottles, enough to eat from the communal meal, and stay drunk and stoned morning and night – excepting the about 8 hours I spent scouring the area for something to make a dollar….
It was so warm and close, a rambling building with wood fire for heat in the one main room, and really, really, great fellows – so wonderful a time, but after about 3 months I had collected every last deposit bottle and can and scrap for the miles radius I could cover, so was truly broke – so hitched off to Florida to pick citrus with a commune there that was so tight and fastidious about everything they kicked me out the second day, so off I went again….
I write here for my own entertainment, to me this is just fun, as writing is as easy as talking to me, and I have always been able to talk to anyone, and deep down, what is it one really likes to talk about? Ones self……
Ah, yes. Sanford… he ended up getting rabies and they had to take him behind the barn and blow him away….. life can be so sad……
Hopp – I do not tell lies, not everyone has led such a dull and vacuous life as yours – some of us have been out in the world a great deal. It is hard to imagine you as a magnet for anyone judging by your post – but then it takes all kinds, even your kind, I guess….
‘and deep down, what is it one really likes to talk about? Ones self……’ Yup, that’s all you. I love to talk to others about the world we share, and virtually never about myself. The world is vitally interesting and I’m not.
I think he was ‘offed’ by Unherd but has reincarnated and is being a little less ‘ranty’ – welcome back Sanford !!
MB
Martin Bollis
2 years ago
“In San Francisco, it was just a matter of days before thousands of soldiers were “restoring order” in the city — which included shooting those who were trying to collect food for the needy.”
I know nothing about the 1906 earthquake but a little about human nature. I suspect the sudden removal of order provoked as much anti social human behaviour- looting and such like, as mini utopias. I doubt that the appearance of the army was treated by most as an unwelcome intervention by elites reestablishing control.
A family friend was a teacher in San Francisco during the earthquake in 1906. She did not mention looting or the army or communes and as a child I did not ask her the questions I would ask now. A pity in retrospect.
Last edited 2 years ago by Jon Hawksley
RB
ralph bell
2 years ago
I have always dreamed of living in a commune but never seemed to come across one and life carried on.
I think modern life for most people would be much improved with more communal living, with less loneliness and more compromise, tolerance and understanding. It would also be better for the environment and there would be less pressure on personal financial security.
I guess it would take something pretty major to convince most people to try it though, especially now we are generally so atomised.
J
JT H
2 years ago
The author has misunderstood “utopian living” if she believes two days of a community banding together after disaster represents such. If so, then she is welcome to visit Houston or Baton Rouge after hurricanes or any midwest town after tornadoes for all of her utopian needs. This as distinct from communes set up for specific ideological purpose, most of which, as the author notes, are quite short lived when the reality of human nature sets in. My own belief is that the scalability of “back-to-mother-earth” communes is limited by Dunbar’s number. Once a population exceeds that number, checks and controls must be placed into service to maintain trust and diminish the free-rider problem.
The author, despite admitting to these communes being small and short-lived, ends with a hope for massive (read: entire globe) communal response to climate change. Quite a leap to address a problem that is vastly already rife with hyperbolic exaggeration.
Last edited 2 years ago by JT H
AH
AC Harper
2 years ago
Intentional communities never last long and therefore are ‘not the answer’ for general society. But they do encourage the idea of Utopian living… which probably does more social harm in the long term.
The community at Findhorn in Scotland was born in 1962 and was formalised as the Findhorn Foundation in 1972. It is currently home to more than 400 people. See Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Findhorn_Foundation
JJ
James Joyce
2 years ago
To answer the question posed in the title—NO!
WT
Warren T
2 years ago
Hmmm. The allure of reading the remaining pages of a book while sitting naked on the ground, penniless. The stench of human body odor, mixed with a perpetual wood fire, wafting throughout the encampment. Eating scraps of food to survive. And I’m sure every one of the drunkards and stoned intellectuals are the happy and fun sort to be around. Sounds like a wonderful choice.
I lived it for years, over a decade – it is not so bad, pretty rough though, but seen in memory, it does take on a rosy light –
The people you ended up around were mostly damaged ones, but very human – more than urban people really. Often not educated, often from really hard lives, what I call fringe people, and they all have stories to tell, which not so many urban ones do. I like people, and enjoyed hanging with so many characters. And the body odor is not a problem, that is more a urban problem, people living rough tend to be more like wild things and not have BO. The nakedness is not a common thing.
It is a hard life, it is one few people could take for long, so one moves on and gets back to normal life after a wile. You would not like it.
Julian Farrows
2 years ago
You’ve nailed it.
AL
Andrew Lale
2 years ago
The attempt to insert ideological structures into actual history is painful and awkward, and destructive of the real recording of that history.
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Bit of utopian wistfulness and cod-psychology in the writing of the article, and if you want crazy communes look to Russia where they do the craziest, and at least one of them, the Doukhobors, have kept it going since the 1600s, and are still kicking around in Canada, likely still ready to mass march nude and burn down government buildings, as that is their traditional protest when messed with….
But….the commune memories still are so strong in me, from back around 1980, when I lived in a truly wonderful one……
I had left London after dropping out of school and became a drifter, a ‘Road Freak’, living out of a pack and hitch hiking dirt poor for many years when I stumbled onto a tiny commune in Oregon, and stayed through most of the winter, and it was the happiest time of my life. There were no jobs of any kind so I spent all day walking a dozen miles a day collecting scrap and deposit bottles, enough to eat from the communal meal, and stay drunk and stoned morning and night – excepting the about 8 hours I spent scouring the area for something to make a dollar….
It was so warm and close, a rambling building with wood fire for heat in the one main room, and really, really, great fellows – so wonderful a time, but after about 3 months I had collected every last deposit bottle and can and scrap for the miles radius I could cover, so was truly broke – so hitched off to Florida to pick citrus with a commune there that was so tight and fastidious about everything they kicked me out the second day, so off I went again….
You remind me of the Dennis Hopper character in Apocalypse Now.
Maybe he is his long lost twin brother
Sanford! Is that you?
Was he a good man? Was he a kind man?
Hi, Hopp
I write here for my own entertainment, to me this is just fun, as writing is as easy as talking to me, and I have always been able to talk to anyone, and deep down, what is it one really likes to talk about? Ones self……
Ah, yes. Sanford… he ended up getting rabies and they had to take him behind the barn and blow him away….. life can be so sad……
Hopp – I do not tell lies, not everyone has led such a dull and vacuous life as yours – some of us have been out in the world a great deal. It is hard to imagine you as a magnet for anyone judging by your post – but then it takes all kinds, even your kind, I guess….
‘and deep down, what is it one really likes to talk about? Ones self……’ Yup, that’s all you. I love to talk to others about the world we share, and virtually never about myself. The world is vitally interesting and I’m not.
I think he was ‘offed’ by Unherd but has reincarnated and is being a little less ‘ranty’ – welcome back Sanford !!
“In San Francisco, it was just a matter of days before thousands of soldiers were “restoring order” in the city — which included shooting those who were trying to collect food for the needy.”
I know nothing about the 1906 earthquake but a little about human nature. I suspect the sudden removal of order provoked as much anti social human behaviour- looting and such like, as mini utopias. I doubt that the appearance of the army was treated by most as an unwelcome intervention by elites reestablishing control.
A family friend was a teacher in San Francisco during the earthquake in 1906. She did not mention looting or the army or communes and as a child I did not ask her the questions I would ask now. A pity in retrospect.
I have always dreamed of living in a commune but never seemed to come across one and life carried on.
I think modern life for most people would be much improved with more communal living, with less loneliness and more compromise, tolerance and understanding. It would also be better for the environment and there would be less pressure on personal financial security.
I guess it would take something pretty major to convince most people to try it though, especially now we are generally so atomised.
The author has misunderstood “utopian living” if she believes two days of a community banding together after disaster represents such. If so, then she is welcome to visit Houston or Baton Rouge after hurricanes or any midwest town after tornadoes for all of her utopian needs. This as distinct from communes set up for specific ideological purpose, most of which, as the author notes, are quite short lived when the reality of human nature sets in. My own belief is that the scalability of “back-to-mother-earth” communes is limited by Dunbar’s number. Once a population exceeds that number, checks and controls must be placed into service to maintain trust and diminish the free-rider problem.
The author, despite admitting to these communes being small and short-lived, ends with a hope for massive (read: entire globe) communal response to climate change. Quite a leap to address a problem that is vastly already rife with hyperbolic exaggeration.
Intentional communities never last long and therefore are ‘not the answer’ for general society. But they do encourage the idea of Utopian living… which probably does more social harm in the long term.
The community at Findhorn in Scotland was born in 1962 and was formalised as the Findhorn Foundation in 1972. It is currently home to more than 400 people. See Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Findhorn_Foundation
To answer the question posed in the title—NO!
Hmmm. The allure of reading the remaining pages of a book while sitting naked on the ground, penniless. The stench of human body odor, mixed with a perpetual wood fire, wafting throughout the encampment. Eating scraps of food to survive. And I’m sure every one of the drunkards and stoned intellectuals are the happy and fun sort to be around. Sounds like a wonderful choice.
I lived it for years, over a decade – it is not so bad, pretty rough though, but seen in memory, it does take on a rosy light –
The people you ended up around were mostly damaged ones, but very human – more than urban people really. Often not educated, often from really hard lives, what I call fringe people, and they all have stories to tell, which not so many urban ones do. I like people, and enjoyed hanging with so many characters. And the body odor is not a problem, that is more a urban problem, people living rough tend to be more like wild things and not have BO. The nakedness is not a common thing.
It is a hard life, it is one few people could take for long, so one moves on and gets back to normal life after a wile. You would not like it.
You’ve nailed it.
The attempt to insert ideological structures into actual history is painful and awkward, and destructive of the real recording of that history.